Good early morning from Krakow, Poland.

Today's post is about God's mission in Europe AND YOU NEED TO READ IT AND WATCH THE VIDEOS. I just wanted to get out of the way-- God wants you to pay close attention to the blog this week. He told me so.

But seriously, we shot some video on our trip. I hope you will take a moment to read the posts, watch the video, and learn about engaging Central and Eastern Europe with the gospel.

Right now, I am sitting with a group of Strategy Coordinators in the fancy room I twittered yesterday. A Strategy Coordinator is "is a missionary sent to a country or people group to get to know the people, culture, and language and develop a plan to initiate and nurture CPM's among the people."

According to the regional web site, they are in need of more strategy coordinators and part of my hope is that some of you who read the blog might come and help and some of you might come and stay as a Strategy Coordinator.

Here are some updates on what we heard today:

Trey Shaw in Budapest, Hungary. He is the Strategy Coordinator for Budapast and you can see their site here: budapestteam.blogspot.com. They are planting churches in Budapest, particularly in North Budapest and doing works of service to show and share the good news of Jesus Christ.

Hungarians are incredibly intellectual and often consider Christianity to be for those who are not uneducated. What Hungary needs most is new team members, particularly:

1. In the arts. Someone who can speak the arts language and engage that culture.

2. In the business world. Someone with and MBA and business sense to create a business consulting firm.

3. In the university. The university is the magnet for the country-- the ground is ready to be tilled and worked in student ministry.

Trey is working through the church in North Budapest as the starting point. They are using Christianity Explored as an outreach resource.

Ron Brown is a Cluster Strategist for Poland, Czech Republic, Slovakia, and Hungary. A cluster strategist supervisors Strategy Coordinators.

He explained that the countries they serve feel like stepchildren in Europe. They were really Western European cultures but were taken over and brought into communism. They are very suspicious of evangelical groups-- wondering what they "really want."

In this area, some common evangelism methods just don't work. To them:

Man + microphone + podium = propaganda.

People don't want short term visits, they want relationship. They need to be connected with incarnational Christians in a place where less than 1% are followers of Christ. Although 60% would say they are Christian (Catholic, Reformed, or Lutheran), but few are genuine believers and followers of Christ. Nominal belief (so often found in the United States) just did not last during communism. People see themselves as "Christian" when defined as a cultural value, but are not Christ followers.

More on these interviews later-- including videos.

Yesterday, I talked with some of the pastors I brought with me. Here is an interview with Rick White, pastor of City View Church talking about how the arts can be used to reach postmodern Krakow. Rick's church has a strong arts ministry and that comes through in the interview.

And, I shot a little piece about urban church planting. The video crew is actually putting together something more professional for their region. However, I have asked them to let me hack some of the video and the result is here:

You can find out more at the CEE site here.

CEE [central and eastern Europe] is ripe with challenges and opportunities. This region is defined by the lingering shadow of communism -- the oppression of spirit and repression of freedoms that robbed people of their identity and dignity. The residual effect of this passing regime now permeates society as a sense of hopelessness. A cavernous void exists in the very soul of the people that longs to be filled -- a void left by an atheistic system that imprisoned its inhabitants in demeaning commonality.

...We, the missionaries of CEE, are working throughout this vast land -- from Greece to Finland, Poland to Siberia -- with one goal only -- hope for every heart, a church-planting movement for every people.

There are some pictures from while most of you were sleeping last night. Click the Twitter feed to learn more.

And, lest you think we did not have any fun, we helped some missionaries have a little reminder of home, Wayne's World style. Mark Edworthy (on the left) is the Interim Regional Leader of Central and Eastern Europe:

Please feel free to drop any questions or suggestions below.

Catalyst Friends,

Here are the stats I presented at Catalyst on Friday. I promised to post them here today.

As you will recall, the numbers are those who agree, somewhat or strongly, with the statement listed. I have only listed the agree percentages. You can download the PowerPoint I used here. You can pre-order the book, Lost and Found, here.

Thanks for coming to Catalyst and coming by the blog. And you are welcome to come back by and stay up with the blog this week to learn more about church planting in Europe!

Here are the numbers grouped by topic:

Views of God (those who somewhat or strongly agree)

God, a higher or supreme being, actually exists.

• 20-29: 81%



• 30+: 73%

There exists only one God, the God described in the Bible.

• 20-29: 57%



• 30+: 48%

The God of the Bible is no different from the gods or spiritual beings depicted by world religions such as Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, etc.

• 20-29: 58%



• 30+: 67%

Jesus died and came back to life.

• 20-29: 66%



• 30+: 54%

Views of Church (those who somewhat or strongly agree)

I do not think my lifestyle would be accepted at most Christian churches.

• 20-29: 39%



• 30+: 30%

The church is full of hypocrites, people who criticize others for doing the same thing they do themselves.

• 20-29: 67%



• 30+: 75%

I believe I can have a good relationship with God without being involved in a church.

• 20-29: 90%



• 30+: 88%

The church is the only place to learn what it means to be a Christian.

• 20-29: 9%



• 30+: 6%

I think Christianity today is more about organized religion than about loving God and loving people.

• 20-29: 77%



• 30+: 83%

Christians get on my nerves.

• 20-29: 46%



• 30+: 44%

Spirituality (those who somewhat or strongly agree)

I consider myself to be spiritual because I am interested in knowing more about God, or a higher supreme being.

• 20-29: 73%



• 30+: 62%

People who attend a Christian church are generally more spiritual than those who do not attend.

• 20-29: 39%



• 30+ 27%

When a person dies, his or her spirit continues to exist in an afterlife.

• 20-29: 82%



• 30+: 69%

There exists a place of reward in the afterlife, sometimes called heaven.

• 20-29: 77%



• 30+: 58%

There exists a place of punishment in the afterlife, sometimes called hell.

• 20-29: 60%



• 30+: 44%

Openness to Outreach (those who somewhat or strongly agree)

If someone wanted to tell me what she or he believed about Christianity, I would be willing to listen.

• 20-29: 89%



• 30+: 75%

I would be willing to study the Bible if a friend asked me to.

• 20-29: 61%



• 30+: 42%

If a church presented truth to me in an understandable way that relates to my life now, I would attend.

• 20-29: 63%



• 30+: 47%

If people at church cared about me as a person, I would be more likely to attend.

• 20-29: 58%



• 30+: 38%

I would be willing to join a small group of people to learn more about the Bible and Jesus.

• 20-29: 46%



• 30+: 27%

Download the full PowerPoint presentation here.

Many of you who are readers of my blog know of my concern for global missions. With that in mind, I am a "shared" but the IMB for several times each year as part of a joint venture. I speak at some events, consult occasionally, and try to connect pastors with God's global mission.

I started getting into a global state of mind while I was at Catalyst. I spoke on Wednesday to the church planters. The International Mission Board was there highlighting our new resource called OneApp, which I will explain more in detail later this week.

So, after I spoke at my Catalyst main stage session (with the obligatory picture posted to the right-- also posted, along with all the others, at http://twitpic.com/photos/edstetzer), I was off to Prague five hours later and then connected to Krakow where I am now.

We did some of the normal touristy things when we arrived, having visited the city square and then the Wawel Royal castle. (Yes, I am carrying a man bag. I have had it for a while but am glad to be in a place where I do not have to hide it in shame. It's is a man bag, not a purse.

Yesterday, my fellow team members spoke at local churches. (One of them, Jeff Noble, blogs and is posting pictures to Flickr.)

I preached yesterday and talked about the Kingdom of God and its relationship to the church.

I will be sharing much about international missions work over the next week. As many churches seek and strive to be more missional, this must never lead to a de-emphasis of global missions. Missional is not mission-minded, but it must never be the opponent of mission-minded. We need both/and (with more of the both) rather than either/or.

So, this week, we are working with missionaries and church planters working hard to engage postmodern Europe through evangelism and church planting. We are humbled to see how they are sacrificing for the gospel and the Kingdom. My hope is that we can be some help, but also encourage others to come along and help as well.

Then, in the fall of 2009, I will be also taking a group to a Two-Thirds World destination. More about that soon. But, since I am in Europe I want to talk Europe for a bit.

First, all week we will be posting Europe info on the blog. If all goes well, I will have lots of video and pictures. (There is camera crew following us for this very purpose.) I plan to interview missionaries and church planters and post their info here at the blog-- and I promise some good content.

Part of what the IMB is doing is looking for ways to partner with innovative churches and networks in the United States. A few months ago I mentioned Larry McCrary and The Upstream Collective, an informal network of missionally-minded churches and individuals from various denominations and backgrounds. The people involved in The Upstream Collective are seeking to get involved in God's work in Europe while also being more incarnational in their own communities.

The next time we are in Europe it will be a part of The Upstream Collective's "Jet Set Tours," week-long vision trips in various European cities. The goal for Jet Set Tour participants is to experience and explore the culture, and through that, begin to discern ways their churches can get plugged in, in Europe.

I'll be hosting a Jet Set Tour to Rome and Marseille with Darrin Patrick from May 22 to June 1, 2009, and then we're looking at doing London and Paris with Daniel Montgomery, May 22-29, 2010. The Upstream Collective is also working on future tours to Scandinavia and Spain.

If you're interested in a Jet Set Tour, let the folks at The Upstream Collective know, since the Jet Set Tour groups are intentionally kept very small. More information is on their Web site (www.theupstreamcollective.org). You can e-mail them for more information on the existing trips I mentioned.



Today, we are heading to a local university to teach and then will spend the evening with college students. Come back this week to learn more about what God is doing in Eastern Europe.

Last night at Gabe Lyons house, I had the chance to visit with Joe Vacanti, Director of High School ministries at The Chapel at CrossPoint. I have followed The Chapel for a couple of decades (see their history here). Their founding pastor (James Andrews) was an encourager and friend when I was a twenty-one-year-old church planter in Buffalo, NY. It was great to hear from Joe about some of the great things taking place in their church and the church plant they recently launched in Buffalo.

Just recently, The Chapel at CrossPoint planted a church near my old church in Buffalo. I was blessed to give some advice to Brek Cockrell and Jerry Gillis related to the planting of The Church at Elmwood. I keep up via the Internet and saw how they bought an old Catholic church in a neighborhood I have walked a hundred times while planting there two decades ago.

The Chapel is a non-denominational, multi-site church in Buffalo, New York that sees about 4,000 people gathering together on Sundays. The Chapel is currently meeting at two different campuses: CrossPoint in Getzville, NY, north of the city of Buffalo, and a second campus inside Regal Cinemas on Elmwood Ave in the city of Buffalo. LifeWay Research had a conversation with Daryl Largis, executive pastor at The Chapel to talk about their strategy that has led the church through a significant transition. You'll benefit from reading it.

LifeWay Research: Tell us about The Chapel.

Daryl: The ministry is located in the suburbs of the city of Buffalo which is in western New York and the church has been around for about 50 years and has in the last seven to eight years experienced some very unique things certainly for this region. There have been a number of factors that have contributed to the experiences of the church.

LWR: Can you elaborate for us?

Daryl: Part of what has occurred is a strategic shift in the focus and mission of the ministry. This shift was facilitated by some new leadership as well as some other things taking place in the community at large and has basically landed us in a place today where we are a lot more externally focused. When you ask about our mission and what we are trying to accomplish at the Chapel there are basically four things that we would say are important to us and what God has called us to be in this community and, in fact, has allowed us to be a resource as well as an influence to other ministries in this area even state wide and even nationally and in some instances in other like minded ministries that we are now partnering with.

LWR: What are those four things?

Daryl: First we take what we call a geographic ownership of the proximity and the demography surrounding our campus. In doing so we are trying to insure that every man, women and child has repeated opportunities within that geography to hear and see the gospel of Jesus Christ.

Secondly, we are going to accomplish the spread of the gospel message through partnering with other ministries in our area within that geographic zone or circle. We are also going to plant churches with the purpose of getting the gospel message in areas so that it can be heard and seen.

The third step that we are trying to accomplish is to instill in our organization and our ministries a true sense of interdependent leadership. By this we mean there are people with gifts that God has given to the church and we are trying to determine how to utilize those and how to provide opportunities both from a lay perspective and a paid staff perspective.

The fourth item is basically having a discreet, distinct and intentional focus on spiritual formation of those involved in this ministry. Spiritual formation is the focus of our teaching, our activities, our small groups, and the overall environment of the church.

So those four things lived out in the lives of various ministries that we might do, I think, have been critical to us in not only making an impact for this region, but have allowed others to catch that vision and join us in being a part of what is happening at The Chapel.

LWR: Several times you have mentioned partnering with other ministries in your neighborhood so that every man, women, and child can be reached with the gospel of Christ. What does that look like?

Daryl: There are several different ministries or organizations that meet weekly or monthly on our campus. For example some churches come together on our campus or at other places on a monthly basis to discuss ministry to the community. We probably have about sixty churches and ministries that engage in conversation with us about how to reach the people with the gospel of Christ. There is also a sense of partnership because we want to work together to accomplish the goal. While there is what I would say some sameness and some what I'll call common purpose around the vision, how it fleshes out in a particular area vary because the geography and the social and economic factors are different. And so while there is what I will call a common purpose, how the gospel is seen and heard in that particular context might be different.

We have only been participating in intentional partnerships for about a year. It takes a while to build these relationships and to build trust and credibility because these are different denominations, different backgrounds, and different histories sitting around the table talking about a greater purpose. The process can be challenging, but it is also very rewarding.

LWR: Tell us about your extensive community work.

Daryl:We have taken a proactive approach in actually studying the demography of the area surrounding our church for a five mile radius. There are about 120,000 thousand people in that radius and we are taking ownership of them. We are all about being proactive and going into the community and saying, "What would a church look like if it were here and in involved in this particular group? And who is here? Where do they live? What do they do? Where do they work? What is their situation? What is their worldview?

LWR: What was the church like years ago?

Daryl: We would have been described as a larger suburban church that was a fairly older congregation with a more traditional approach to ministry. The church was very successful and had a strong reputation in the area. It was not known for being a church that did a lot of partnering with other ministries, planting churches, or being a resource for other things happening around them.

LWR: What has changed?

Daryl: For forty years the church never planted another church. In the last three years we planted a church in a more urban context. We have gone from a church trying to be a place and a ministry to a group of incarnational believers in Christ that not only meet together on Sundays, but are about being that witness in the community all of the time. We are trying to take the transformation power of the gospel and live it out for others to see and hear.

LWR: How the the current leadership come into their roles?

Daryl: The founding pastor became ill and was stricken with cancer. While he was still on this earth he recognized that he needed to find somebody to replace himself. Through that process God orchestrated some very unique events where an individual came to this ministry, basically to transition it to the eventual lead pastor. There was a time in which there were two lead pastors. One acted as the bridge between what was and what was to be.

LWR: What change took place during the transition?

Daryl: The way God brought things together not only with people, but also with circumstances was very unique and during that process not only was there some change taking place, but growth also started to occur. There was a lot of change going on over a very short period of time. We built a new facility but we knew that was only the beginning and it was the beginning of us becoming a resource and an encourager and a equipper for this region. And to be a part of facilitating the kingdom as best we can and as God leads into the future.

LWR: Are there things we have not talked about that you would like for us to know about The Chapel?

Daryl: We have other ministries and programs that are occurring in our church. God has given us some excellent individuals to help facilitate ministries for children, college students, women, men, and worship. Fundamentally it all fits under the umbrella of what we call our desire to follow what God has led us to and that is to be a part of his mission in reaching every man, woman and child in this area and helping to facilitate that in other places.

There are few megachurches in Western New York-- but the Chapel at Crosspoint does not seek to just be big, it wants to reach a community and plant churches in others.

For those of you who came to my talk yesterday, here are the notes I promised. This is from the message I gave at Catalyst church planting lab.

In Matthew 16, Jesus' relationship with His disciples takes a dramatic turn. Until now, the disciples were expecting a front row seat as Jesus fully ushered in His Kingdom. And on the surface, that made a lot of sense.

We have a King... check. We have a Kingdom... check. Let's get this show on the road and restore the Kingdom, right?! Not exactly.

At this time, Jesus introduces a new element. He tells them about you and me-- the church. What in the world is that?

When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, He asked His disciples, "Who do people say that the Son of Man is?" And they said, "Some say John the Baptist; others, Elijah; still others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets." "But you," He asked them, "who do you say that I am?" Simon Peter answered, "You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God!" And Jesus responded, "Simon son of Jonah, you are blessed because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father in heaven. And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the forces of Hades will not overpower it. I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth is already bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth is already loosed in heaven." And He gave the disciples orders to tell no one that He was the Messiah.
Matthew 16:13-20 (HCSB)

Three Key Kingdom Recognitions for Church Planters:

1. Jesus is Messiah.

Matthew 16:13-16 13 When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, He asked His disciples, "Who do people say that the Son of Man is?" 14 And they said, "Some say John the Baptist; others, Elijah; still others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets." 15 "But you," He asked them, "who do you say that I am?" 16 Simon Peter answered, "You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God!"

Understanding the Lordship of Christ is essential to planting Kingdom focused churches.

First, note that Jesus left and went into a Gentile area-- he announced the "church" in Gentile land.

The disciples answered and indicated "who" people thought he was.

Some referred to Elijah / John the Baptist.

Malachi 4:5 Look, I am going to send you Elijah the prophet before the great and awesome Day of the Lord comes.

Luke 1:17 And he will go before Him in the spirit and power of Elijah, to turn the hearts of fathers to their children, and the disobedient to the understanding of the righteous, to make ready for the Lord a prepared people.

Some might have though that Jesus was a resurrected Jeremiah because 2 Maccabees hints at that.

But Peter, speaking for the group, knew he was the Messiah.

This was not the first confession of faith, but here Jesus asked for his confession and this was the first clear one. There had been some exclamations but this was a little different.

In this verse, Jesus announces that the church is birthed in the wake of the Kingdom. The Lordship of Christ is essential if you are planting a Kingdom focused church.

Jesus needs to be Lord of your church plant:

• He is the hero, not your creativity.



• He is the answer, not your solutions.



• He is the relationship, not your community.

2. Peter's Confession is the Foundation of the Church.

Matthew 13:17-18 And Jesus responded, "Simon son of Jonah, you are blessed because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father in heaven. And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the forces of Hades will not overpower it.

The authority does not belong to Peter, but to his confession.

Simon's nickname, "Peter" is equivalent to English "Rocky."

petros [a stone], and upon this rock [petra--a large rock] I will build My church.

But Peter is not the foundation of the church.

Ephesians 2:20-21 Built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus Himself as the cornerstone. The whole building is being fitted together in Him and is growing into a holy sanctuary in the Lord,

1 Corinthians 3:11 No one can lay any other foundation than what has been laid--that is, Jesus Christ.

Gates of Hades. Forces of Hades. Means the forces of death. No army attacks with gates, but it is the Kingdom that is advancing.

3. The Kingdom's Keys

Matthew 13:19-20 I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth is already bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth is already loosed in heaven." And He gave the disciples orders to tell no one that He was the Messiah.

The church (represented here by Peter) holds the keys to the Kingdom. It is not the Kingdom, but it is created by the Kingdom.

What are the keys:

1. People are admitted to the "door" of the king Kingdom through proclaiming the good news (the keys)



2. The church is to exercise binding and loosing though church discipline (next is in Matthew 18)

Matthew 18:18 I assure you: Whatever you bind on earth is already bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth is already loosed in heaven.

Interestingly, Jesus only mentions the Church two times. Yet, there are eighty-five references to the kingdom of God/heaven in the Synoptic Gospels. What are the implications? Is the Kingdom more important than the Church? Did Jesus introduce the Kingdom and the Church formed in its wake? Just what is the connection between the Kingdom and the Church in redemptive history?

The entrance of the kingdom of God is through the keys of the church.

The Kingdom births the church in its wake-- and church planters are on the vanguard of Kingdom work.

What do you do:

1. Take seriously the keys.



2. Know the Kingdom is more important that your church.



3. Evident and kingdom mindset.

Have you ever wondered about the terminology of megachurch and gigachurch? I did-- and I asked around.

The first term that was widely used was actually "Superchurch." Elmer Towns was the most common user and popularizer of that term and most early megachurch research used that term.

Thanks to Warren Bird, Director of Research at Leadership Network, who wrote his Ph.D. on the megachurch phenomenon, I know the origin of the word "megachurch."

meg•a•church n. A church averaging 2,000 or more people in attendance during weekly worship gatherings.

Frequent readers of this blog will know of my appreciation for Francis Dubose as the first person to use the word "missional" in the manner we do today. My "Meanings of Missional" series spends much time with Dubose.

Well, quite to my surprise, his is the first printed reference to the word "megachurch." You can find that in Francis DuBose, How Churches Grow in an Urban World, Nashville, TN, USA: Broadman Press, 1978.

But, it was megachurch uber-researcher John Vaughn who first used the term to refer to churches over 2000 in weekly attendance. (The 2000-mark is the standard today thanks to John's influence.) And, he is the first to use it in a book title, Megachurches and America's Cities: How Churches Grow (1993).

Also, in 1991, Prepare Your Church for the Future (by Carl George with Warren Bird, Revell, 1991) helped popularize the word megachurch. The book was based on some popular training Carl had done with pastors from America's largest churches for the 3 prior years. That book quickly sold over 100,000 copies, which no doubt helped popularize the word

What about gigachurch?

gig•a•church n. A church averaging 10,000 or more people in attendance during weekly worship gatherings.

Well, actually, I first saw the term used by Missouri Synod Lutheran and World Magazine editor Gene Edward Veith in an article here.

Veith expressed great enthusiasm for his newly coined word, explaining:

I realize that I have just coined a new word--the giga-church--deriving from a parallel with computer technology, in which megabytes of memory grew exponentially into gigabytes. The word "gigachurch" for metastasizing megachurches deserves wide currency. Use it and let's see if it catches on. If you hear the word elsewhere, please report, and remember that you saw it first on the Cranach blog.

But, in his comment section, one of his astute readers pointed out that it was Bill Easum who first used the word. I emailed Bill to be sure and it was the case, and he confirmed it.

The first mention I could find was in a Washington Post story that explained:

Where megachurch refers to congregations with an average of 2,000 or more worshipers every weekend, gigachurch refers to those with 10,000 or more, said Texas-based church consultant Bill Easum...

Special note: most researchers who use the word "megachurch" don't like the term "gigachurch."

Come back later today for one more megachurch interview.

(The graphic about is a Wordle of my first post of megachurch week.)

Megachurch week stretched to two weeks. Perhaps it needs a new name-- Supersized Megachurch Week.

Well, megachurch "week" is not quite done. I will have two more posts, one later today and one tomorrow. Here is what we have covered so far:

Megachurch Week-- Looking at Research

Interview with Kerry Shook

Megachurches in Outreach Magazine

Interview with Perry Noble

Who's Who in Megachurch Research

Megachurch Interview: Joel Hunter

Warren Bird's Megachurch Dissertation on Megachurches as Spectator Religion

Megachurch Interview with Brady Cooper

Enough on megachurches (for now, at least).

First, for the Church of God pastors and church planters I spent the day with on Monday, click here for the presentations I mentioned. Thanks so much for having me share with you.

On to Catalyst...

If my flight has made it (always a question when flying the Delta-owned ASA airlines), I'm at the Catalyst Conference for the next few days.

Today

I will be speaking at the Catalyst Start Lab Wednesday afternoon. I will be doing a live interview via the internet Wednesday afternoon at plantingchannel.com/catalyst. You may also want to check out the New Thing Network's Discover the Dream workshop on PlantingChannel starting at 8:45am eastern time.

Friday

My main stage session will be around 1:45pm on Friday. I will be talking about our new book, Lost and Found: The Younger Unchurched and Churches that Reach Them. A copy of the sampler will be in each of the registration bags.

Throughout the Week

Of course, I'll be Twittering throughout so you can follow my updates and observations from Catalyst as it all goes down.

Also, be sure to see the LifeWay and International Mission Board exhibits while you are there... I will be hanging around both of them at different times.

See you at Catalyst.

Brady Cooper is the pastor of New Vision in Murfreesboro, TN. Brady and I recently met at The Standard, a restaurant in downtown Nashville and had a little too much fun.

But that was not the first time I had seen Brady. He was on the staff of my church before he went to New Vision. And, I first saw Brady speak during an unusual Sunday morning memorial service there at the church.

When Glenn Weakly died, Brady came back to speak at his memorial... and did a great job. You see, he is not just a former staff member, he is the former pastor's son-in-law. It made the memorial service even more meaningful to learn of their connection.

Brady asked me to speak at New Vision recently and though I could not pull it off-- but I hope to soon. Of course, I will now be a little intimidated becuase of his comment below about guest speakers.

Five years ago New Vision averaged 400 in attendance; today they average 2,500 people in four worship services. Last year the church grew by 700 people, or 37%, and was #52 on Fastest Growing List.

What's happening at New Vision? Simplification and evangelism.

LifeWay Research had a chance to talk with Brady about the growth of New Vision and what he believes was instrumental.

LifeWay Research: Is it true that for the last five years New Vision has experienced 40% annual growth?

Brady: Yes that is close. We were averaging about 400 in attendance five years ago and today we are at about 2500

LWR: What is the team at New Vision doing that has caused such growth?

Brady: There are a couple of things. First of all our location is good because the community surrounding us is growing. Secondly we have cut down on some of our programming so that we could perfect other areas of our ministry. For example, we have dropped our Sunday night worship and have focused on just one weekend worship service. We have really tried to be intentional by creating an environment where the members of New Vision are comfortable bringing their un-churched friends.

LWR: What expectations do you place on members of New Vision?

Brady: We want people to worship, to experience being a part of a group, and to give in ministry or to serve

LWR: If these are the expectations what are opportunities are being offered to members?

Brady: Our staff is constantly scheduling appointments and meeting with people to encourage and help them go to the next level. This could be helping them come to know the Lord or helping them become involved in the ministry. We do not have a great assimilation process other than our ministerial staff helping people get plugged into the ministry.

LWR: How is New Vision involved in the community?

Brady: Last year we had about 200 people become involved in short term mission trips. In the local community once a quarter we do a community outreach event where we take part in different service projects such as handing out rolls of quarters at the local dry cleaners or we will work with Habitat.

Usually each community event will have seven or eight different options in which people can become involved and the event takes place on a Saturday four times a year. We also have other ministries going on in the inner city. Some of the members of New Vision are African American. We have partnered with them in their community doing things such as an after school program. We are also involved in planting a church in the Dominican which has excited our members.

LWR: New Vision has a lot happening within the church walls and in the world around them. What number of people have you baptized this year?

Brady: From January to today we are right at 200 baptisms. In one day this summer we baptized 120 people which was a big push for us. Before this baptismal service all of our ministries with our youth, Bible school, and our week of prayer and fasting was coming to a close. We also see fruit from our evangelism strategy. We call our strategy the "as you go evangelism strategy."

The strategy encourages every member to have at least one person that they are praying for and developing a relationship which allows them to share Christ. Because of these things we baptized 120 people which was the highlight of our summer.

LWR: Brody what advice would you give to pastors in churches that were plateaued or declining on the subject of church growth?

Brady: I would probably look at taking some of the people that I had relationships with and that wanted to see the church grow and I would really begin to invest in these individuals. I would not bring the subject so much to the pulpit or try and butt heads with those that do not want to change but I would really try and invest in a sort grass roots level with those people that want to grow and allow them to carry the vision to the masses.

I also think pastors and staff should over think and really plan out the weekend service so that the people get the best offering we have. I also think that the weekend services should continue to flow. We try not to take any weeks off at New Vision. I was on vacation with my family this summer and we went to a church and they had brought a missionary speaker in to fill the pulpit. This was fine but I felt that the gentlemen was not a great communicator and he rambled on about forty-five minutes which as a guest did not appeal to me.

You have one chance to reach a visitor. I think excellence breeds excellence and growth.

LWR: What other issues do you feel are important to the church?

Brady: I think staffing is important. At New Vision we try to be slow to hire and quick to make changes. I would not use the word fire, but I think sometimes a lot of churches have staff members that are great guys or great gals but they just don't share the vision. They don't have a passion for growth and there isn't strong accountability sometimes on church staff. Keeping this in mind we have made a lot of in different ministry areas that just weren't growing and that has created a real different environment for our staff. Our staff knows what is expected. There is not a sense of fear but they realize that this is a high calling that requires time and energy. A church should not be afraid to make changes.

Often times I will take note of a pastor I think will grow in impact and influcence. I think Brady is one of those pastors.

Last week I mentioned Warren Bird's dissertation on megachurches, and today on the blog you can download the whole thing. Those interested in what's really happening inside megachurches will benefit from his dissertation which explores the stereotype of whether most people are only spectators at really big churches. This is particularly helpful as it explores "free rider theory."

Free rider, a term coined in 1965 by Mancur Olson, is used for those who do not contribute in the provision of a public good, but enjoy these goods anyway. In churches, these are the individuals who come and benefit, but do not yet commit. So even if they do make substantial financial contributions, the average level of commitment in the church is lowered and the whole becomes less effective. In other words, if any organization has too many "free riders," churches included, the organization will fail.

Bird analyzed national surveys for churches of all sizes for group involvement -- as a way of sorting between "spectating" and "involvement." Bird explains,

The question of whether megachurches encourage spectator religion can be addressed from many perspectives. The approach of this dissertation will be: first, the proposal of an answer (namely that the data do not support the view of megachurches as spectator religion); secondly, the presentation of social theory that might support that answer; and third, the testing of the social theory presented through quantitative analysis supported by qualitative interviews. The outcome, if the hypotheses are well constructed, if they are reliably and validly tested, and then if the findings are cogently presented, might contribute to the increase of knowledge and ultimately to the sway of public opinion.
(pg. 56)

Bird concludes that people's involvement is the same or better in larger churches than in smaller churches. These findings were later cited and expanded upon in the book Beyond Megachurch Myths (2007) by Scott Thumma and Dave Travis, and also validated in the megachurch chapter of What Americans Really Believe (2008) by Rodney Stark.

The rapid growth of megachurches, in both size and number, has surfaced several

issues of interest to sociologists. "Megachurches have exploded," Drucker says, "because

they asked, 'What is value?' to a nonchurchgoer and came up with answers the older

churches had neglected" (Drucker 1998:169-170). What value are megachurches supplying that other churches are not? "The greatest value to the thousands who now throng the megachurches--both weekdays and Sundays--is a spiritual experience rather

than a ritual."

Perhaps the most interesting sections are chapter 1, which gives a history of the development of megachurches, and the appendix, which gives photos and commentary on many U.S. megachurches. You can download Warren's dissertation below.

I could be wrong, but I am guessing that Joel Hunter and I have some unusual connections:

1. We just co-taught a doctoral seminar at Reformed Seminary.

2. We have done a funeral together (my father-in-law).

3. We both think my mother-in-law is a very nice person. (Very nice. Really.)

4. He prayed at the DNC and I, well, was near Barak Obama once.

OK, the last one probably is not really a connection.

Joel and I recently had lunch in the parlor of Reformed Seminary in Orlando (with our friend Steve Childers) and talked gospel, kingdom, politics, and a bit about my mother-in-law (grin). Later on, one of our research team members interviewed Joel.

Joel Hunter has served as the senior pastor of Northland since 1985. During his tenure the church has grown from 200 to 12,000. Northland is "A Church Distributed," meaning the church is arranged around the relationships of the congregation and partner ministries, rather than around a physical church building.

The people of the church worship at multiple sites throughout Central Florida and serve their unique, local communities. The sites are all connected during the worship experience through a two-way video connection that allows different parts of the services to be distributed among the sites and gives congregants opportunities to interact with one another in real time.

Worshipers also participate at 1,500 smaller sites worldwide via Northland's innovative Webstream application.

All of this makes Northland one of the most technologically savvy churches in America. LifeWay Research was able to talk with Pastor Joel about Northland's strategy for making disciples.

LifeWay Research: Tell us about some of the exciting things happening at Northland.

Pastor Joel Hunter: Northland is in a huge transition. We worship in a new building with all of its capabilities that was specifically built more for the people who would never come inside of a building than it was for those who would gather within this particular building. It has been a watershed moment in our history.

We have had the philosophy of being a "distributed church" for about 10 years now. And what that has meant for us is we have not only worshipped concurrently with several sites in town, but we have worshipped concurrently with people online. Now as that develops we are growing tremendously with those who are worshipping with us online. Some of the online participants signed in with all of their information while others just observe. This part of our ministry has grown tremendously. Because of this growth we are beginning to do everything and design every program so that we are not just a big church with inside programs, but so that any site of any size anywhere can be a part of our programs because we want to focus on those people who gather of any size, but especially for the worshipping point, the home church, the organic church, or whatever you want to call it.

LWR: So what does all of this mean for Northland?

Pastor Hunter: It means that these people gather together because they need some help or want to be connected to a larger group in the church to worship, but they are going to do their own pastoral care, their own education, their own community service, all of that kind of stuff where thy are. And that fellowship is important. So for us the development has really birthed a vision of being able to-- plant churches is probably too big a term for us because the term church has so much western baggage to it-- but we are enabling small congregations to do evangelism and discipleship and service and worship together all over the world. And so that's the course that we are on right now. That is where everything is pointed here in our church.

It has tremendous benefits to our people's maturity because when you come to a church and you are constantly reminded that you are just getting filled up for the people who are not there inside the church with you, and everything we do as a church is to make us witnesses and servants to those who are not regularly in church programming. It really does give you a better handle on how and what it means to love God and love your neighbor as yourself.

LWR: How would you respond to the critical comments of those that believe worshipping online is forsaking the gathering together of believers?

Pastor Hunter: First of all, the ideal of online worship is that you would gather others to worship with you where you are. So the singular worshipper that just doesn't want to go into a church, although they are still valid, is not really our target. That is why we have never been on TV. The observance of a worship experience is not the goal.

LWR: What should people do that wish to worship with Northland online?

Pastor Hunter: People just go to the website and sign in to whichever service. Online worshippers can see who is worshipping with them at that moment. And if they like they can chat with others that are signed in for that worship service as well over i-chat. They also have the option to speak with ministers on duty and they also can participate in the worship experience. Whenever the congregation is addressed and asked for their favorite scripture, for example, those online can respond. As the technology develops we will literally be able to see on the walls of our church many of those who are worshipping with us so those people will be literally in the same room. So if Denis is worshipping from South Korea or Thor from Iceland--those are two regulars we have--we will be able to see their images all in the same room. It's this kind of togetherness that goes way beyond what you would think for technology.

For people my generation, I am 60 years old, it is a little bit more difficult to imagine that this is not a very cold and artificial experience, one that is rather mechanical. But for the people who are my kids' generation, they have lived off this sort of technology.

I have three sons. They have lived online since they can remember. They do life online. And the kids just coming up now, for them there is nothing artificial about it. My generation grew up in a theater style worship or life. The coming generations will all grow up where the screen is a connection or a window to the world. The screen is some degree of intimacy although it never replaces and should actually generate geographically based togetherness. And so that is what we are trying to do. We are trying to use a virtual community to create a local community so that people have actual physical fellow Christian relationships where they live so that they can care for one another and encourage one another in ministry.

LWR: Northland is doing a great job with bringing different geographical locations together for worship through the internet, but have you developed a way in which to help your online viewers/communities to continue the worship experience after the service through things such as small groups etc? Are you going to develop leaders for those internet congregations that are growing and possibly becoming another site of Northland? If so what qualifications would you expect to see in such a leader?

Pastor Hunter: It is in development right now. Because of the philosophy that we have we are probably not going to emphasize those larger congregations that are multi sites. Once you get past a 100 people you need a certain leader with a certain skill set and a certain gift mix to develop that big a group. And that big a group also carries with it its own expense and it carries its own rate of failure (the failure of church plants in the nation). So what we are going to concentrate on are leaders of small congregations. That is, you know, a dozen, 20. That anybody can take responsibility for if they have the ongoing support and reference to people who have been trained as pastors and can support them in that in that way.

For a long time here we have done small group leadership. We have virtually ordained small group leaders. They do some of the baptisms in our church, funerals, and some of the marriages so that it all doesn't have to go back to a large church leader for those sacerdotal functions.

Ultimately what we want to do is to take any group anywhere that has three or more and somebody wants to take spiritual responsibility for this group we want to take that person and mentor them and to provide resources for them. I am not talking about money but about communication. If a person in our own congregation decides to take on that spiritual leadership for a small group, they become a spiritual leader in every sense. This has already happened in our history. So we know it works. We cannot form a church but we can equip those that are coming to Christ to bring their friends together to form and a church and we can appoint a spiritual leader where they are to guide them

So that's essentially what is in the works right now for us.

LWR: What does virtual worship look like for those inside the church walls?

Pastor Hunter: At the beginning our of services we read off a personal welcome to those that are worshipping with us online and to the rest of the world. People inside the church are excited by this. Even if your 80 years old this is still fascinating that they are worshipping with you.

But the point is, we do have people who go out in short term missions. And we have hundreds of them, that develop this heart to be linked in worship and service to people in other parts of the world. And so they really want to pour our leadership and our resources into a church that will benefit them as well as benefit those who worship in a facility at a particular address.

LWR: Do you feel that virtual worship has opened up a whole new mission opportunity?

Pastor Hunter: Oh, absolutely. For example we have a girl who has volunteered to go all over the United States to visit people who are worshipping with us online. She is taking a video camera with her and getting their story so that we can get to know them and figure out how we can serve them better. The same thing happens in different parts of the world. If we are having people who are worshipping with us online on a regular basis we are trying to create a relationship with them. We also hope that we will have people from our church interested in visiting with them in their country and getting their story. We are not just sending mission teams to countries because we have heard that there are poor people there. We are going and assisting those that worship with us. We are asking them their needs. We go to support a Christian already there who is doing ministry and support them in their ministry. So this is greatly expanding our missions program and our mission's mentality.

LWR: How has Northland successfully moved your congregation to follow along reaching different generations, because you obviously you feel that you are reaching younger generations with internet worship?

Pastor Hunter: We are not trying to get rid of our 80 year old members or to change their style of worship. If they want to come to church and go to Sunday School they can still do that. We have not leapfrogged the traditional church. We have expanded the traditional church. We have a larger vision of what being the church means and that includes people who don't walk through the door. Elders used to say that "we'll take care of and love everybody the best we can who walks through our doors". The distributed church says, "We will take care and love everybody the best we can who will never walk through our doors," also. We do not try to convince people that are really content and growing that they now need to try virtual worship.

LWR: Pastor Hunter it seems that Northland is expanding the vision of the traditional church. What is your definition of church?

Pastor Hunter:The church is Christians coming together to worship and serve in order to expand the kingdom of God.

LWR: What advice would you give to pastors in smaller churches or struggling churches about growth and reaching people?

Pastor Hunter: Well, first of all there is a ton of information on stuff about things such as discipleship, growth, or church programs. A great deal of resources can be found online and they are free. So I would encourage them to take this stuff and to use it. But here is what I would say to any pastor and any church no matter how small and struggling because I was a pastor of a church that was small and struggling. You do two things.

First of all, you love your people enough not only to minister to their hurts, but to make them ministers to other people's hurts because that is when the church really starts to grow. You can only grow from those that are not yet included if you are talking about numbers. Your attention has to be as much on those who are not yet in your congregation as those who are in your congregation. If you only pay attention to those that have been in the congregation a long time, most of them have relationships already established within that congregation. If you pay attention to the new people that come in and teach them how to minister to others they have a relationship with then most of their relationships are outside the congregation. So in your congregation minister to the hurts of people and love them where they are. But teach them to be ministers also.

And then, secondly, just get involved as a church outside the church walls. Do community service. Do short term missions, whatever it takes to give yourself away. Because that is exactly what Christ did. God came in bodily form out of a very safe environment and he just went to where the need was. And whether that is in your town or that is in another country, what will happen is the church will grow when you go literally, physically to where the need is. That is the way this church grew and that is the way that lots of churches grow.

Fascinating stuff from Joel Hunter. Feel free to give your thoughts below. And, don't mention my mother-in-law in the comments!

And, be sure to visit the other post from MegaChurchWeek at the blog:

Megachurch Week-- Looking at Research

Interview with Kerry Shook

Megachurches in Outreach Magazine

Interview with Perry Noble

Who's Who in Megachurch Research

One final note: It looks like megachurch week got too big for just one week. So, we will end it here for this week-- but post more for next week, including interviews with more pastors and more research information.

Ed